Discuss anything Gymnastics

The real world is annoying me and I think it is time we move on so have any gym news?

UglyFatkid thinks we should discuss this

What do you think? I will read it tomorrow.

Tulip says, lets discuss College National Championships, done………. discuss.

Aly and DWTS? Europeans?

Please discuss all so I can have something to read while I am supposed to be reading

I am going to bed:)

43 Responses to “Discuss anything Gymnastics”

  1. Uglyfatkid Says:

    I don’t remember how I got there, but I found this article/blog interesting. I don’t agree with all of it, but it posed some interesting ideas. When I have sometime a little later, I’ll write up what I agree and disagree with.

    For now, I figure its a good article to discuss as a group.🙂

  2. tulip Says:

    NCAA is this weekend, right? If I could find out how to watch it, I’d be cheering on Bridget.

  3. sanitynmotion Says:

    Ditto on Bridget. Thanks uglyfatkid for the article I’ll have to read it tomorrow.

    Hey is Aly safe? On DWTS?

    Random question: does anyone know what’s going on with Rebecca Bross?

    • gymtruthteller Says:

      Aly is safe. DL Hugely was ousted.

      NCAA’s is this week, I think it starts either thursday or friday

      Collegegymfans.com is your friends

    • Case Says:

      Bross is coaching level 3s and 4s at WOGA. She should retire but she won’t.

      • sanitynmotion Says:

        You think she’ll ever compete again or is she just coaching? That’s odd. I wonder if she’s depressed. I can’t help but feel bad for her even though I was never a fan of her gymnastics.

      • Uglyfatkid Says:

        I feel bad for her too. For her sake, I hope she just moves on with her life (whatever that is in the end). Even before the knee injury, I don’t think she could keep up with the current girls. She was good, but not quite good enough to win with the current mix of the top girls.

        When she tanked trails/nationals, I almost cried for her. I was never a huge fan, but my heart broke for her anyway.

      • sanitynmotion Says:

        Same. I can only imagine what was going on behind the scenes with the whole Nastia thing. Bross had to have known about it. It showed when she completely fell apart on bars after Nastia fell.

        I have to wonder if Bross was more relieved for not making the team – like Atler was – or if she really wanted it. It seemed like she was too willing to go with the flow; if she really wanted it she would have committed to doing the AA or at least having a floor routine. Her lack of drive to come back (opposite of what we see with Jo) is telling me she was probably more relieved not to have the burden of the Olympics on her shoulders, and now is likely coaching because she doesn’t know what to do with her life, and gymnastics is all she knows. I feel for her, I really do.

        Who knows maybe one day SHE will be the outspoken one with a tell-all book. We need to introduce her to Moceanu. Ha.

      • Uglyfatkid Says:

        LOL. You crack me up Sanity.

        I first that that her not doing floor was just Lukins doing, then I saw her on the tour and realized that she was still having issues. She was throwing easy skills (I say that knowing full well I couldn’t even do a level 1 skill), but they were labored and all over the place. In the end, I think it was a combo of the knee and Lukin that stopped her from doing floor.

        It’s a shame that her Patterson sucked so bad. She may have been an alternate had she been able to stick that and not crumble on that last bar routine.

      • Cookie Says:

        I have heard in multiple places that Bross’s dad was really really pushy. So if that is true then I would think she would be relieved to not have gone to the Olympics, if she was only really doing elite gymnastics because of her parents.

        I never particularly liked her gymnastics but after seeing her wreck her knee on vault combined with the favoritism and attention that Nastia was getting I was really rooting for her. I hope she can move on and do something that really makes her happy in life.

      • gymtruthteller Says:

        I felt bad for Bross and was rooting for everyone to hit bars to keep Nastia away but than I think about how she still doesn’t get she was being sold out in favor of princess Nastia and than I don’t feel bad for her anymore.

      • tulip Says:

        GTT, i like your comment that Bross doesn’t get that she got sold out. I agree.
        Don’t know them or anyone involved, just reputations. I would wonder why her dad, if he is as loony as they say, didn’t take her out of WOGA with a nice ‘up yours’ to the Liukins and find a place where a coach would want her there as a priority. She seems to be one of those lost little sheep who got used and then thrown away when she had the greatest need.
        Wonder if Valeri is charging outrageous fees for those intro classes? “Now your 5 year old can learn cartwheels from an almost world champion! Sign here- cash only”

      • Cookie Says:

        I get the feeling that there is some kind of cult of personality around Nastia at WOGA. Her name & pictures are all over the gym, so I can see parents taking their kid there thinking that there daughter’s pictures will be up all over the place some day. [I don’t think Valeri would take Nastia’s pictures down even if WOGA produces a gymnast that wins every single gold medal an Olympics though.]

        The elites that came after Nastia seem to worship her as well to some extent, at least based on their twitter & instagram pictures with her. I would understand if she was a really nice humble person but she seems so conceited and bratty that I just don’t get it. But I do kind of see how crazy gym parents would get sucked in by all the hype and celebrity and become convinced that their kid is the next WOGA star.

        It’s just sad that there are /so/ many good gymnasts who just get lost or swept aside in elite gymnastics. Bross is just a more high-profile example. It’s part of the sport when only 5 make it to an Olympic team but it is still unfortunate.

  4. exgymgurl Says:

    Free to watch online on espn 3 for ncaa this weekend

  5. exgymgurl Says:


    a lot of nice coverage of european podium training and some great pics by Bea from Couch Gymnast

  6. JAS4 Says:

    I thought the article had some good points I didn’t agree with all of them but I do think it has some truth to it.

    As for Euros I saw on tumblr (I think TCG and examiner) that the Romanians were doing well in podium training. I hope we get to see Afan’s Amanar(granted that she can perform it safely).

  7. Sara Says:

    I agree with some points in the article. I think the main problem for the Russians is a lack of confidence,which she somewhat said. Vika especially. That girl has a lot of potential, but every time she competes, she looks like she is about to run off a cliff or something. She doesn’t have that confidence that the Americans, or even Aliya has. Though I don’t feel that many gymnasts from any country have the confidence the Americans have.

    She said that the Russians essentially choose which gymnasts will be successful, but I see that USAG does that a bit as well. Once Nastia proved herself, she was almost given a free pass to the Olympics. Although maybe the key word is almost. Maybe the Russians would have still sent her after she royally screwed up, whereas the Americans didn’t. Who knows. And what about Chellsie? She was essentially written off by Marta after 2008. Alicia? (I’m very bitter about that still.) I feel like a certain group of gymnasts are built up in both countries, and the others are ignored.
    Someone commented this on the post which I thought was really interesting: http://zveyll.tumblr.com/post/48127139373/on-cultural-viewpoints-and-russian-gymnastics

    Side note: does anyone understand what the Russians mean when they say that they are lacking depth? I’ve seen them say that before but I’m having a seriously difficult time understanding what that means for some reason… They seem chock full of depth to me..

  8. uglyfatkid Says:

    Sorry, I was out and about and couldn’t post all my thoughts the first time.

    First off, Gabby has only one raw talent…and that talent is being able to piss me off. Every time I think about the Oprah interview I want to punch someone. Seriously…PISSED…ME…OFF.

    The writer kept concluding that Russia chooses which gymnast(s) that it wants to succeed, and that in the USA anyone who tries hard can make it. Well, I hate to break it to them…but this has been happening in the US since the Marta regime. Gabby’s success was solely based on the wants/desires of the regime. Chellsie’s downfall was also caused by the regime, so to imply that this is something that only happens in Russia is a fallacy. USAG is not based on the merit system, it’s based on the Marta system.

    When it comes to funding/coaches/doctors/etc, I believe that it boils down to who is going to give them the most success. While I don’t agree with the doctor situation (everyone should have expert doctors), I understand the reasoning behind funding the individuals that will bring your country the most prestige/money. The program is run by the Russian government, and as such they need a level of payout that we don’t need here. If one of our gymnasts bombs, in the end it reflects more on the coach or individual as opposed to just the country itself. If one of their gymnast bombs, it reflects poorly on the Russian program and the individual. If the program isn’t succeeding, the government is less likely to more pour money into it. So in the end, do you focus on those that you think will win, or focus on everyone? The choice seems clear given the circumstances. Money is fuelling the decision, and in the end I would put my money on those that I think have the best potential as well. Do they need to spread the focus on more than just those that are succeeding??? Yes. Do they need a program that will develop the younger talent? Yes. But if you only have the money for one, something has to go.

    However, I think there are a few things we could learn from the Russian program. We should have coaches working together to create a team…not individual coaches ONLY creating individual athletes. Aly/ASac could have used WOGAs help on bars. All of WOGAs gymnasts could have used Mihi (sp?) or Maroney’s coach on Vault. ANYONE could have stepped in with Jordyn and slapped Gheddert upside the head about those connections on beam and bars. In the end we lose out on getting fantastic all arounders (like Miller), because we are more focused on self prestige, then really helping the athletes.

    Truth be told, the article/blog wasn’t fantastic, but it made me question the Russian program…and in turn our own. Could we benefit from having a national team of coaches who share the gymnasts? Each taking turns training and developing certain areas in each individual? Would it cause more success? Or would it create cookie-cutter routines? Would we be creating a program for Marta to control even more than she does the current one? In the end I don’t know what the answers are, but I think we can create a better system than we have now. Starting first and foremost with dethroning Marta and her regime.

    • mimi Says:

      i may be wrong on this point – but why would brestyan’s help woga? or an external coach not from geddert’s gym help with jordyn? at the end of the day, these gyms function as local small businesses. they compete with each other! yes maybe it would be for the “greater good” for the elite girls if there was more collaboration but i dont think it’s ever going to happen. not just because each gym wants the credit for a successful gym, but purely just from a monetary perspective.

      i do agree perhaps you would have more well-rounded gymnasts if particular coaches took the reigns on training certain apparatuses, but i cant see a coach, who is presumably being paid by the gymnast’s family for however long for coaching, willingly let the girl be coached by another gym just for one thing. they need to address these inconsistencies within their own gym e.g. mihai needs a better bars coach, woga a better vaulting coach etc.

    • mimi Says:

      also – more centralisation would run the risk of MORE control and “corruption” wouldnt it?

      i am also not sure what the answer is!🙂

      • Uglyfatkid Says:

        I completely agree that it will never happen under the structure that we have today…and you are 100% right about the competing business comment. Gymnastics in the US is business, not a sport. Everything is set up to make money first, and after that is done, then to make great athletes. Don’t get me wrong, we all have families to support so I am all for making money. I’m just posing the question of whether the system is functioning the best for the athletes. Right now, it’s kind of weighted on the sides of the coach ($) and Marta (control and $).

        Again, you are right that more centralization could cause more corruption. However, we see that now with the Marta regime…so I guess it’s down to picking the lesser of two evils: Marta or an ACTUAL committee with EQUAL sway/power to oversee the program. Not this Marta dictatorship we have going now. LOL

      • tulip Says:

        I honestly don’t more how much more corruption is possible, but.I’d prefer to NOT learn.

    • Gymbee Says:

      Agreed. US does definitely not have the “anyone can make it” system. If they did, Marta wouldnt sneakily suggest that people stop training/dont upgrade. ASac and her dropping floor comes to mind, and Kyla’s lack of upgrades.

      Conspiracy time, but what if Marta had a finger in Geddert not changing Jordyn’s beam? I wouldn’t put it past her. Surely Marta with all “expertise” should know that Jo wouldn’t get credited for those connections.

      • byrdisthewyrd Says:

        That’s what I’ve never quite understood as well, Gymbee. If Marta is always telling people when to upgrade or not to upgrade or what events to drop, etc., then why wouldn’t she just get all superior to Geddert and demand that he make those changes on beam. It seems like she makes those kinds of demands to other athletes so why not Jordyn? If she did have a talk with Geddert and he ignored it, wouldn’t we have seen Marta’s wrath towards Jordyn and Geddert?

      • lol Says:

        Because Marta did not want Jordyn to win.

      • Uglyfatkid Says:

        Agreed to all. However…I think we are already seeing backlash with Jordyn right now. Marta could care two sh!ts about her at the moment. I think that is part of the motivation that Jordyn is showing. She knows that she needs to bust a Memmel…go all out and make it so Marta can’t pass her up.

  9. exgymgurl Says:

    Well, they do send gymnasts for pointers at different places. They whole point of camps is to get different perspectives on the athletes and help everyone improve.

    However, the coaches decided to put Mattie ( splatfest) larson in on floor in 2010 team finals. This ultimately was her downfall, and I think the opposing coaches all knew it was one way to get her out of Olympic contention. I made the point that I thought that was the case then, and I think it worked. I dont think they work together. As for Geddert he was told about the beam connections and decided he knew best. Whether it came from Mihai, the judging panel at camp, or Marta he didnt listen. Maybe he has learned.

    In the documentary on Aly, Mihai has said that because of school / child labor laws in MA his athletes can’t train as long as what they can in Texas ( he specifically pointedly said TX.

    If the system is truly cooperative, think of how all the athletes could benefit. And the coaches as well. I do not think it is, because I think every gym wants to be known as the one that had multiple olympians…..

    • Uglyfatkid Says:

      I think you are right about Mattie. She was setup…and it worked like a charm! As for Geddert, he’s so arrogant that I think he really thought that he didn’t need to do anything with the connections. He knows EVERYTHING. We all saw what happened because of it, and the one it hurt the most was Jo. Could a centralized system helped Jo in this situation? Who knows…but one thing is for sure…Jo owes Geddert a good junk punch over it. LOL

  10. Biyatch Says:

    Its a long time in the sport before athletes in the US get funding from USAG, which isnt state funded. Even when they do get some national team funding, if they intend to compete NCAA (which at some schools can be worth $250k+) there are limits to how much they can take from USAG. As businesses first and foremost, each individual coach’s priority has to be on promoting their individual athletes and hoping their success translates into business success.

    I remember Alicia talking about camp once and saying that while there is national staff, you are mainly still working with your own individual coaches.

    The individual coaches decision protecting their athletes vs the team in the US is really an interesting dynamic. Like someone mentioned Mattie in 2010 costing the US the world championship, Marta had said she didnt want her in the lineup but was overruled by the coaches. Geddert blogged about how he was unhappy of Jordyn’s spot in the lineup during the beam rotation in prelims but that it was decided by Marta and the other coaches (presumably he wanted Jordyn to anchor instead of Aly.) Then during the prelim aftermath Bela went on a rant about how Jordyn should have been anchoring something as the reigning world champ. Marta’s response was that she protects the team above all else (Aly had won both beam and floor at visas and trials plus that logic doesnt work totally since Aly was the leadoff on half the events.)

  11. sainabou nyang Says:

    Its early still, but Ive been wondering how many juniors Marta will add to the national team this year. I fully believe most of the rio team will be juniors on the 2013-2014 nat team. Will these be juniors picked for pac rims next year or Youth Olympics (usag needs to send a juniorr to this event, my pic is Bailey).

    Also do they still do junior pan ams anymore?

  12. sanitynmotion Says:

    I would have to say that the Russian regime and the US regime are actually pretty similar, it’s just that the “favoritism” or “selection” if you will of which athletes to fast track is more discrete.

    You can’t tell me that Marta/USAG (which are one and the same almost) had nothing to do with Gabby and her mom deciding to up and leave Excalibur and knock on Chow’s door. I think that was all Marta working behind the scenes. Gabby’s mom has the smarts of a Keebler elf (if that) and probably thought nothing of Gabby being with a gym that was paying her way until Marta whispered “Olympics” in that fat cow’s ear. That got her up off her a$$ right and quick. And you can’t tell me USAG didn’t fund that plane trip and have that discussion with Chow. Who knows – Marta likely told Chow Shawn wasn’t on her Olympic roster but this new girl is, so Chow if you want a ticket to London you coach this girl. She maybe wanted Liukin to at first but he likely refused as he had his own daughter to coax a bar set out of and he had the head case Bross to deal with (sorry Bross, but you were a head case. Not your fault totally but you were). You think Gabby’s mom paid for her to fly out there and get coached by Chow and paid a family to take her daughter in and all that…when she basically had that for free at her own home? Excalibur was funding everything for Gabby until she made the national team. Then poof Gabby be gone – right when she made that team. Interesting, no?

    The doctor thing is unfortunate – for Russia, I guess maybe they don’t have as many highly skilled doctors. In the US it doesn’t seem like the injured gymnasts have any issues getting proper care/surgery from injury, so that is a difference.

    As for Mattie, I think Marta liked Mattie’s style but obviously she had headcase issues. Marta has no patience for that. I can see her trying to not put Mattie in floor finals but the coaches who ruled against her I honestly do not think were doing that hoping Mattie would choke. There was still a gold medal on the line for USA and that would serve to benefit ALL of the coaches and their athletes. If they wanted Mattie to choke they would have hoped for that to happen when it came to an individual title, no? I just think that was a bad call on the coaches part to be honest. They were probably hoping to prove Marta wrong. If you think about it that 2010 team was Sloan, Coquatto, Bross, Raisman, ASac, and Larson. Only one coach (Brestyan) ended up on that Olympic squad and he already had the floor worker in Raisman and potential floor in ASac. And Liukin was the pet coach all along so he had nothing to worry about.

    While I do believe that yes the coaches internally have it out for each other (hoping their athletes fail so their own athlete can make it) the same can be said about the girls too I’m sure. Even though the girls are nice people they have worked their entire lives and made many sacrifices to be where they are. You think if Jo could have done some mind games and had Aly or Gabby fall so she could take an AA spot at the Olympics would she have gone for it? Totally. Same with Gabby or Aly. The 2 per country rule sucks but they went in there knowing someone would be disappointed. Marta was out to make sure Gabby was in there and when Aly was beating everyone that was when the writing was on the wall for sure. Geddert probably knew going in to floor his athlete was out but didn’t want to admit it to himself. You could tell there was something in his eyes when he was talking to Jo right before she took floor. And I for one do believe Marta knew what was happening on Jo’s beam routine but said nothing because honestly that was just another way to pave the road for Gabby. And Marta loves Aly too so she actually had it her way at the end. She didn’t have to step in on that one because Geddert was such a bonehead coach; he would do it his way no matter what and Marta probably figured they could rely on Gabby for beam over Jo when it was finally realized too late that Jo’s beam wouldn’t work on the world stage.

    Although this time around, with Jo making a comeback, it will be interesting to see if Marta goes out of her way this time to screw Jo over. She didn’t have to last time because she had enough AA depth (Aly, Gabby, even Kyla) to make Jo feel pressured and Geddert was a bonehead. This time, if Geddert has had a “come to Jesus” moment and plays it so that Jo has an edge, who knows if Marta will try and step in. If she does I see Geddert being more of a loose cannon and speaking/lashing out (which would be somewhat awesome) but at the same time he still has a program he has to defend and he can’t afford to be blackballed by Marta.

    I can see Jordyn easily beating the likes of Ohashi with her skills back to where they were – that’s what will make this interesting.

    • Gymbee Says:

      Great post sanity. Definite agree with you re Gabby. I don’t think for a second that her mom would move her to a different state unless Marta had indeed told her about Olympics. Honestly I don’t believe Gabbys story about how she saw Shawn, blabla, and told her mom that “she had to go to that coach”. She was what, 13,14? How did she have enough insight and maturity at that age to know that she “could not reach that level at Excalibur”. Normally people trust their coaches at that age.

      Oh and I think Jo can definitely beat Ohashi. And Lexie.

    • Biyatch Says:

      You point out a very important aspect (that was the most blatant especially this year at visa’s with nastia) Marta CONTROLS scores. She can make sure the gymnasts she wants get the scores she wants. Her attitude towards Jo will be interesting.

      I dont think we can entirely blame her for Jo’s beam connections though. Geddert was stuck in the mud ass and just didnt listen. US scoring was so inflated that when Jordyn competed on foreign soil for the first time in 2012 he was “shocked” she didnt get credit. I think this also speaks to the need of US girls to get more international exposure. I maintain that the best thing that happened to Aly was getting slammed at Jesolo in March last year. After that meet she cleaned up and upgraded both beam and floor, which put her in the AA.

      • gymtruthteller Says:

        If Marta had said to change her routine he would have changed it.

      • sanitynmotion Says:

        Yeah – my rant was trying to say/point out that Marta purposefully did not have him change her routine. She likely knew Jo would not get those connections. Had it been Gabby/Chow Marta would have said change it.

    • mim Says:

      fascinating sanity! i never thought of marta failing to tell geddert to fix jo’s beam connections.. and buttering him up by making him head coach. it really does
      make sense. to his credit, i think if marta does try to screw jo over in this squad, he’ll be vocal in his protestations. his gym mainly focuses on level 10/NCAA right? less to lose possibly?

      a healthy and back-at-peak-condition jordyn would kick katelyn’s and lexie’s behind for sure.

  13. exgymgurl Says:


    I know this is not gymnastics but this is way cool…and I think these are pictures of the culprits…..

    • terrigymfan Says:

      Wow this is interesting exgymgurl! I know it is terrible since this is a huge tragedy but I just love trying to solve a mystery. I haven’t looked at this thoroughly but it appears to be the lone guy in the blue coat with the beard. He’s a real loser type plus it looks like his back pack that was blown up. I’m thinking the two guys who were dressed alike and talking into earphones were undercover security. The blown up backpack didn’t look like the ones they were carrying.

    • Tortuga Says:

      Thanks for the photos exgymgurl. Really interesting to look over. Looks promising.

  14. GymMom Says:

    Very chaotic in Boston today. A hospital & the federal courthouse were both evacuated. Conflicting reports about suspect being arrested.

    • Uglyfatkid Says:

      I just hope they catch the SOBs that did this. They deserve to rot in jail the rest of their lives.

  15. tulip Says:

    And the Super Six are: Florida, Georgia, Alabama, LSU, Oklahoma and UCLA

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